The last few weeks all of us in the pro-family, pro-life cause have been debating who the best candidate would be for President of the United States. The debate has been heated and based on deep convictions on my part and that of those that agree with me as well as disagree with me. However, I have to ask the question: What if I and others in the pro-family, pro-life cause were as convicted about sharing the good news of salvation with the lost on a daily basis as we are to organize, campaign and debate for a presidential candidate?
Whenever I use my radio program to talk about politics the phone lines light up. Whenever I write a column on politics, politicians and the pro-family leaders that support certain politicians, the feedback button on my website is hit hundreds of times. People leave passionate feedback agreeing and disagreeing with my columns on politics.
However, whenever I have written columns on using the moral law to evangelize the lost, the importance of training the hearts and minds of our children with Biblical truth, and the importance of teaching and defending Biblical doctrine, the article views and feedback have been much smaller.
It is clear to me that the disparity between the passion and zeal for politicians, policy makers and pundits verses for Biblical evangelism, Biblical discipleship, Biblical parenting and Biblical worldview training is why the country, the church and families are in such a mess.
Just check the amount of the feedback on this article and the article views at the bottom of the page and compare it to the page views and feedback to my recent column on “When Hillary and Obama Win the White House You Can Thank Pro-Family Leaders for not Being Leaders”. The feedback and page views will be much less.
Why? Because I and others like me, care more about politics and the culture war than we do evangelism. Why is that? It is because it does not take any guts or great skill to share your opinion about a political candidate and his policies. If it did there would be far viewer talk show hosts, people calling into talk radio programs, and people debating on the internet. It is also because we are selfish and when we fight for a particular candidate we are helping ourselves whether we admit it or not. Who does not want to help elect a guy that is going to keep your taxes low and keep the nation secure so we can live the American dream?Sure, we care about the life of the unborn but sadly most Christians are not that committed to the pro-life cause. Most people fight for a particular candidate for selfish reasons and if we are honest we will admit that.
Witnessing to the lost is scary and requires thinking about that person’s soul and not about myself and how uncomfortable it makes me.
Maybe this election year instead of asking “what would Ronald Reagan do” we should ask “what did Jesus do”.
If we want to evangelize like Jesus Christ, then we must learn to use the moral law as He did. That means we cannot be afraid to use the word “sin.” According to 1 John 3:4, sin is the transgression of the law. According to Romans, the moral law is written on the heart and mind of every person—thus the conscience (“con” means with and “science” means knowledge). Because of the conscience, every time people sin or rebel against God, they know it is wrong. Romans 7:7 assures us that the law convicts people of their sin.
Through the Word of God we come to understand that we don’t murder fellow human beings because murder goes against the character of God. Neither are we to lie, steal, or break any of the other Ten Commandments because doing so would go against who God is.
Romans 1:21 reminds us, “although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened.” And Romans 2:15 points out that people “show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them.”
Everyone has broken the law. No one can claim to warrant entry into heaven because they have “lived a good enough life.” God’s standard is that people must keep the complete moral law, and no one has done that. The purpose of the law is not to save us. It is to condemn us, to show us our true state, to reveal our sin, and to show us we deserve God’s wrath. Romans 3:20 explains that purpose of the law is to get people to stop justifying their sin. Oswald Chambers offers a perspective on the kind of things many of us are doing right now; being too consumed by things other than fulfilling the Great Commission:
“Satan’s great aim is to deflect us from the center. He will allow us to be devoted to the death to any cause, any enterprise, to anything but the Lord Jesus.”[1] Hebrews 13:9 instructs us to not be carried away by all sorts of strange teachings (deflected from the center) but sadly, that is exactly what is happening for many.
This election year, and every year, instead of asking, “what would Ronald Reagan do”, ask yourself, “what would did Jesus do”, then use the moral law when daily sharing with a lost person.
[1] George Grant, The Family Under Siege (Minneapolis: Bethany House Publishers, 1994), p. 44.
Disclaimer: Worldview Weekend, Christian Worldview Network and its columnists do not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the feedback button.
I think the reason that people comment less with articles talking about evangelizing the lost is because they know that you are right and therefore feel guilty about admitting how difficult it is to reach out to the lost. I know I always make an excuse that I don't feel equipped. But what I really must check in my heart is if I really care. Because if I don't care enough about someone spending eternity in hell then I need to examine my heart and motives. Click here to reply to this post
Very true...
Posted On: 02/11/08 02:56:29 PM
Age 20, MN
...though I must point out that most Christians would not disagree over whether we should evangelize or not (hence why the feedback may be a bit less, though perhaps not so much for the actual hits). However, you point is clear and indeed, should be convicting to Christians who somehow come to the conclusion that politics is more imporatant than evangelism. Excellent article Brannon! God Bless and have a great day! Click here to reply to this post
Politics vs. scripture
Posted On: 02/10/08 04:19:24 PM
Age 60, KS
You are correct about most folk’s selfish interests in politics. I think worrying about tax cuts is but one example. There seems to be a sort of hateful rhetoric that to me is anti-Christian in nature. Usually, when politicians are bent on cutting taxes they also talk about cutting government spending. This ultimately equates to cutting back on programs that mainly benefit the poor and/or underprivileged. We do live by the Golden rule here. Those who have the Gold...RULE!
While I am neither poor nor underprivileged, I do worry about their situation. Yes, we should teach a man to fish so they can make their own way. Sometimes the pond is fished out so knowing how won't yield the results we're looking for. No matter the cause, we need to take care of the needy, even if it means assisting them to become not needy.
We are shipping what were good jobs overseas. I guess we could make a case for tax breaks for corporations to keep jobs in the U.S. I'm sick of the global economy rhetoric and while I also feel for the poor of other nations, I would like them to develop their own structure to make things better for their people. We can also help with that effort.
As for war...while I know it is often necessary and there have been wars for centuries....we need to choose our battles and not fight them for the benefit of additional profits and to the detriment of the lower rungs of our society. Much wealth has been bestowed upon America and we'll loose it if we don't finally learn to LOVE.
That may sound corny but it's the only thing that will ultimately win. I'm not speaking about LOVE from a weakness standpoint...there is also tuff Love.
I am convinced that almost any president will do all possible to protect this nation so we need not worry about that. As for pro-life....most of us are pro-life and anti-abortion but I understand the concept of pro-choice because God did give us a free will.
Wouldn't it be better to teach people about the moral wrong of abortion than to remand it back to dirty back rooms where it had been for over a hundred years?
I have the choice to sin or not to sin.
I was given that choice. Abortion is a choice and while I disagree with it, it is a choice and is very legal. Islam is a religion that is totally intolerant to many of mankind’s foibles. Do we really want to go that direction so a bunch of angry and egotistic men enforce all the rules?
Is there a different Hell for those who wage an unnecessary war than for those who lie, steal and cheat or have an abortion?
Sin is self-interest. The opposite is Love and that's what our religions need to focus on. The bible is replete with information about the Love Jesus taught. If we truly learn to LOVE, the abortion issue and many other sins will finally cease to exist.
Since this is a Christian web site, I would like to hear more about our relationship with God and the Christ and less about Obama, et.al. I don't even like to hear negativity about other preachers. Quit trying to convince Mormons and Catholics that there way is wrong and start talking about what’s right with Christ. Click here to reply to this post
Positive feedback
Posted On: 02/11/08 07:10:14 PM
Age 49, OK
From a pro-life perspective I vote as a prolife only citizen , that is why I am for Alan Keyes . Alan Keyes said if he was voted into office his very first day in office he would sign an Executive Order Banning ALL forms of abortion . I am not sure if people have heard of Alan Keyes but you should seek out his site alankeyes.com he truely is a great american and he was appointed to Ronald Regans cabinet when he was in office for 7 years . Alan answers to God not to a Political Party why do you think you don't hear much about him also the liberal media does not want you to even hear his name period . Please look up Dr. Keyes.
God Bless
Betty Click here to reply to this post
"...I and others like me, care more about politics and the culture war than we do evangelism."
The fact is it IS a culture war, Brannon. The culture is Christianity vs. Secularism. Why should authentic Christians even consider compromising their Biblical values by voting for someone like McCain, Huckabee, or Romney? Yet they will!
When our choices are "evil" or "evil" then we have surrendered our voice as believers to joining with the world, and that is prohibited by Scripture.
Voters seem to either forget that their vote does count and that they either have a choice to vote for a Democrat or Republican. The fact is there are two other choices: one, write in a candidate of your choice who you KNOW espouses your own values, or secondly, consider a bona fide third party candidate...but only after researching their values.
Another fact is, that "Christianity" is no longer PURE. It is tainted by liberalism - the proverbial "wolf in sheep's clothing". Evangelicals are no longer purists by living the Word but more than half have been ignorantly taught from the pulpit to chase after men and have become men-pleasers not Christ pleasers. So effectively one but really get to the root of a spiritual problem in the Church...defining what Christianity today really is. Has the Church become so diluted by Biblical teaching and preaching that it has compromised the very essentials of the faith? Indeed, yes. Click here to reply to this post
Principle or Pride?
Posted On: 02/09/08 10:20:28 AM
Age 47, MO
Friend: I am glad you are advocating Christians to exercise their right and God given mandate to vote. We are commanded to engage the culture and to give Ceassar his due. Howver, I have a concern with your advocating a vote on principle only. The problem is that no man is good enough to appease all Christians and thus are derisive by nature. Who is the perfect candidate? You may say that Ron Paul is the best, others may say that Huckabee is the best, still others would advocate for a lessor known candidate. Yet the fact remains that at this juncture ONLY Huckabee is a viable choice. So, you would suggest standing on principle, a close cousin to pride, and vote a protest? If Christians did this through out history, America would have been finished long ago. Friend: the greater good is to play with the toys available, not to take your ball and go home in protest. Your advocacy is not to use the talents given but to wish or desire for what is not there. God IS and remains in control. Bless God, John Click here to reply to this post
There is much truth in your article Mr. Howse. We should be concerned with what He has us to be and do and only after that, thinking of what is good for the country politically. One problem hat is clearly seen is when people call themselves, "conservative Christians" or any other, "something-Christian." This puts Him behind my personal biases instead of Him, through His word and Spirit being the lens through which one sees life. This is no different from a particular presidential candidate's home church being "black" first and Christ followers second. It can be seen when we look around and see Presidential symbols displayed prominently on the cover of books, tapes and magazines that are supposed to be about Christ and issues of faith.
We need to study those who have come before us that lived under monarchs, despots and tyranny to see how Christians are truly witnesses for Christ (the Greek word is our word for martyr)instead of thinking that this nation was ever His group of followers like Israel of old.
Grace and Peace,
Jim Click here to reply to this post
What is Jesus DOING? How should we respond?
Posted On: 02/08/08 06:03:30 PM
Age 45, GA
Maybe we should ask what is Jesus doing? Is it not the sovereign Trinity that places all principalities in their place? If we do not have a government that recognizes his sovereignty and conducts business accordingly then maybe we should be asking why are we not blessed? To answer: because we haven't been in obedience bringing glory to God. How can we expect our Government to do what we are not exemplifying in our American companies, our communities, our churches and in our families? Sadly, after 20 years of church faithfulness our family is having trouble finding it in God's own body of so-called believers. Those that want the church to be a light on the hill and not imitate darkness to attract darkness look like weirdos in the church today.
Our nation has the ability to learn from Old Testament history, and yet we are not trembling as a nation, nor falling to our knees asking for mercy and reverently praising His name. Certainly, as a nation, we don't appear repentant.
What DID Jesus do? He didn't set out to change the Roman government- He set out to reclaim souls and personally disciple 12 men to do the same. Let us not forget the faithful mothers and fathers who invested in training their children in the things of eternal significance as well as equipped them to stand with biblical convictions in this world. Transformed hearts in truth metamorphosed the Roman government. Centuries later transformed hearts challenged the corruption of the church, and then transformed hearts brought Godly honoring families to American soil.
I thank you, God, for leading me (after years of questioning) to a biblically supported way to evangelize. Thank you for the means of downloading sermons from courageous biblically discerning pastors that help keep me fed, sharpened, and repentant. Thanks for leading me to others who believe Christian world view training is needed in our shallow body of believers. Are we any less easily swayed by a mix of dangerous philosophical ideologies than our Jewish predecessors? Thank you for your Word. I can't do without it in raising my four children to bring You glory by convicting and training our hearts. Thank you God for letting me see the fruits of feeding my children Your meat. No blessing is better than watching the scripture convict their little hearts. How could the church have gotten so off track in training your soldiers in your arm? It took over for the parents instead of partnering with the us by helping to train and equip us.
God grant this nation mercy, the enemies mock and plan our destruction. You have permitted the enemy a place in our own homes when our plethora of bibles go unread. Grant us more of your patience, so many work effortlessly to turn this nation back to you. It can not be done by man's law, but only through your power which you give us through your word. May this time of apostasy soon turn to bring you glory. Mom on a mission Click here to reply to this post
What would Jesus do????
Posted On: 02/11/08 11:05:27 AM
Age 30, MN
First and foremost I'll qoute what I feel is a very important verse in the bible, and one I really try and live by Eph 5:1 we are called to be imitators of Jesus. I've heard everyone talk about "moral law". Now I think following moral law is very important but we have to many christains who think we need to legislate it??? Did Jesus ever do this, was he concerned with swaying the politics of his day??? No he wasn't in fact there are so many examples in the gospels of both sides of the political element of his day trying to sway or pull Jesus into their arguement but in true Jesus form he doesn't allow it instead he asks them unique kingdom of god questions that of course confuse these political elments because there mind is so centered on politicizing their faith that they become confused, wow sound like any christans we know today. Our job as christain is to be christ like the best we can and imitate Jesus the best we can not winning the culture war. We are suppose to live in self sacraficial love for our enemies for the people who speak ill of us. By livivng in this love we are bringing the kingdom of god. Changing laws and making sin illegal is not imitating jesus because he never did this!!!! One more thing to prove how much jesus didn't care about politics or using earthly law to make sin illegal he had a tax collector and a zealot as disiples. Now simon and mathew probably disagreed on a great number of political issues of their day (and by the way they lived in a very hot political time much like today) but you never here about it in the gospels, why is that....because it just didn't matter. Voting the right way and suporting the right political canidate or winning the culture war does not make anyone a better christain. Imitating Jesus and having self sacraficial calvary like love foe EVERYONE is truly living the "christain life. Think about it. Click here to reply to this post
JESUS CHRIST IS THE JUDGE AND THE LAWGIVER
Posted On: 02/11/08 07:27:09 PM
Age 64, OH
Dear friend,You make a very good point that we are to be like Christ and I agree. But you say, "Changing laws and making sin illegal is not imitating Jesus because he never did this!!!!" Then who was it who gave Moses the 10 commandments on the mountain. Was it not the Everlasting Father, The Mighty God who was to come to us as the child who was to be born as Isaiah told us in 9:6. Did not Jesus give them a LAW that they should not murder. The law is for the people who do not have the Holy Spirit of Jesus and because of that they can not follow the Spirit so are to follow the law. Without any law of God they would be led further and further away from God. That is why John the baptist was sent to the people 1st. John preached the law to them so they could repent and follow the law and then be more able to see Jesus Christ for who He is. Any nation needs laws that are from God so that the people will be more able to see that Jesus Christ is the maker of the laws. Lou Click here to reply to this post
Typical
Posted On: 02/12/08 09:06:20 AM
Age 30, MN
Friend I think you need to read my point again. Usuallly when I bring up Eph. 5:1 people run to the old testament as you did, and if you want to get theological here the ten commandments were written and intended for the israelites but thats a whole different discusion. If you read what I wrote I said Jesus in HIS time in the new testament never ONCE used the power of ceaser te enforce moral law, in fact the pharisees used ceaser to enforce "their law" to have Jesus crucified, and I don't know about you but I'd rather imitate our lord Jesus then the pharisees of his day. Jesus came to bring us a radical kingdom of having power under people by having self sacrificial calvary love, especially for the ones who were the sinners, and the ones breaking moral law like the high priests and pharisees,, and he did something totally radical by dying for them!!!! If you remember I said following the law is very important but you can't make sin illegal and all of sudden people won't sin. Jesus understood this and new to change hearts and prevent sin we need to serve sinners by showing them love and compassion and the way to God and hopefully by doing this we save. Who are we saving by making a certain sin illegal???? Legislating sin through the goverment is placing power over people not the self sacrificing power under people that Jesus did, and thats why power over is wrong because it doesn't look like Jesus dying on the cross. Also by bringing moses and the ten commandments into it you prove my point. God gave moses the law to give to his people, God didn't give the law to any form of goverment of that time to then give to moses to then give to the people. Thanks for helping to prove my point even though you didn't realize you were. Also anyone who reads this please don't point out the therotical kingdoms of the old testament they with the new covenant of scripture. I challenge anyone to find in any of the four gospels when Jesus used ceaser to enforce moral law. Gods Bless Click here to reply to this post
ethics or morality
Posted On: 02/12/08 04:05:32 PM
Age 47, MO
Friend: You stated: "I challenge anyone to find in any of the four gospels when Jesus used Ceaser to enforce moral law." I accept your challenge. Moral laws are the "aughts" and the "aught nots", ethics are those morals that a society deems acceptable. So, when you speak of morality, you speak of God's laws and even the heathen kept the laws, Romans 2:14-15, because we all know them by nature and are without excuse. The Pharisees came to Jesus in Mark 12:14 and asked if it was right to pay tax to the government (a question of ethics). Jesus answered: "give to Caesar what belongs to him and give to God what belongs to God" (an answer of morality) Jesus' answer is based upon the 10 commandments #1,8, and 10. So paying tax to the government is in fact keeping the moral laws instituted by God. John Click here to reply to this post
You don't get it either
Posted On: 02/13/08 08:16:09 AM
Age 30, MN
Am I crazy here???? How is that Jesus using the political system of his day to enforce moral law??? You totally did not answer or accept my challenge. Because you know that he didn't! I'll ask it again find me a passage where Jesus USES the political system of his day to enforce moral law. Saying give god what belongs to god and give ceaser what belongs to ceaser is definitly not Jesus using the political system of his day to enforce moral law, in fact that passage is Jesus showing the pharisees the radical kingdom. Jesus is not going to be the militant messiah they are hoping for. I love debating with all of you but don't dance around the question just answer it. Click here to reply to this post
Hello-
Posted On: 02/13/08 12:39:55 PM
Age 47, MO
"Am I crazy here?" Another question that you seriously want answered? Friend: You are unable to see the answer that is provided because you think the Spiritual and the physical are seperate and distinct. I am starting to think that you are still Spiritually dead, but that is not my call. Anyway, of course they are not seperate because Jesus was bodily reserected. You also mis understand what it means to be of the world, fully engaged as salt and light and yet not be "in" the world. Regardless of your understanding, Christ was in the OT the same as the NT and today. So governments are instituted by God the same as God instituted the Kings of the OT, and the other rulers not of Israel. I have a question for you, what is the primary purpose of government if not to serve the people by legislating ethics? Jesus came not to destroy but to save. John Click here to reply to this post
still not answering anything
Posted On: 02/13/08 03:09:05 PM
Age 30, MN
I guess we will just agree to disagree. You did not answer the question and because someone disagrees with your theology does not mean they are spiritually dead???? You are now twisting my words. Just answer the question I think I proved that you didn't answer it, you just do what most christains do when they're wrong they side step the question. Bottom line using the power of goverment to legislate morality is something Jesus NEVER NEVER did thats my point. Now don't twist my words once again laws and morals are very important. What I'm trying to get through is lets be christ like we don't need the goverment to help us with following our beliefs and laws. We as a church should be doing this ourselves. Finally if human history has shown us anything is that when the church controls the goverment and impose its laws through the goverment its been the most bloody, brutal, and barbaric times in history. When the church becomes politically power hungry as much of it has today it stops looking like Jesus dying on calvary for the us. By legislating morality do you think that will all of a sudden make more people moral in the way they live their lives??? Of course it won't, but serving them through self sacraficial love and preaching to them and inviting them to church to hear the word....Well I guess I would rather take that approach then trying to get a law passed against whatever sin they are commiting. Thats christ like. Click here to reply to this post
How's this, part 2
Posted On: 02/14/08 02:47:35 PM
Age 47, MO
Am I right that you are advocating the seperation of church and state? The seperation of church and state is not to presume the seperation of morality and government. Our country was not founded by pilgrims who fled morality because he who is moral has no fear of the Govt. The pilgrims fled the Church of England's attempt to limited their freedom to worship God as they saw fit. Our country was founded on the biblical moral values that are indicitive of a free people governed by God. You cannot seperate God's laws from morality or ethics of a civil government. You cannot have freedom from morality and still have a civil society. Again, morality must be internally governed by the HS or legislated (ethics) for a free people to exist. The only other choice is anarchy or despotism. Freedom is not free and must be viligently defended and protected. Bless God, John Click here to reply to this post
How's this?
Posted On: 02/14/08 10:47:10 AM
Age 47, MO
I think I understand your POV. You said: "Jesus didn't use the power of the govt to legislate morality". That's an interesting take that negates Christ's sovereignty and the fact that ALL govt is set up to enforce ethics, and like I said before, ethics are the morals that a society deems necessary. So, Jesus in the flesh didn't use govt- ok, I give...why would He? He superceeds and govt because He is ruler of all. Your statement has no merit or worth because the constraint has to come from somewhere or else anarchy reigns. You stated: "By legislating morality do you think that will all of a sudden make more people moral in the way they live their lives???" Well, yes I do. How many abortions were there prior to 1973 vs how many now? What's the difference, morality was un-legislated. If illegal drugs become legal, how many people would get addicted because they are easier to obtain? Traffic laws legislate morality, can you imagine the nightmare that would insue if all traffic lights ceased to operate and people drove as their "morals" dictated? True, A real Christian has the Spirit of the giver of morals and it superceeds the laws of man, but we are called to obey both if they are in agreement. So, we don't need the laws, but the laws based on morality do in fact lead to life and Christ- the giver of truth and life. Your advocating witnessing only and internal governance is a dream not based upon reality because most all the world is spiritually dead and would govern by self interest. It would be a blood bath. John Click here to reply to this post
Enjoyable debater
Posted On: 02/14/08 04:57:59 PM
Age 30, MN
John you make a compelling arguement like I said we will just have to agree to disagree on some things, but the one thing I can say we both agree on is Jesus being the way and the truth and the only way to god. Its been really enjoyable debating with you, and with the passion that you present your arguement I can tell you are a man who loves God. God Bless and I look foward to debating you more in the future. Click here to reply to this post
Amen
Posted On: 02/15/08 09:05:28 AM
Age 47, MO
I'm learning that keeping emotion out of an argument is a very difficult thing and still show passion. I see that com-pasion has to superceede or else we are just arguing and not Christ like. Anyway, bro- hopefully next time we will meet and not meat again.... Bless God! John Click here to reply to this post
JESUS NEVER CHANGES
Posted On: 02/12/08 12:54:56 PM
Age 64, OH
The pharisees did NOT follow the law to crucify Jesus but they broke the law. The law says you must have two or more witnesses that agree that someone has broken the law. The pharisees could not produce two witnesses that agreed even though they were bribed to do so. There are not two God's; the God of the OT is the same as the God of The NT. We can trust that the OT or the NT is true. The OT has Jesus Christ crucified in every book if we can see it. Look in the Book of Jonah and see that Jonah took upon himself the blame of the destruction of the ship. Jonah then gave up his life even though he was a prophet of God for the men who worshiped false gods. Jonah like Jesus gave up his life for these men while they were still sinners. Jonah then died and spent three days and three nights in the fish and then was resurrected by God. Jesus said He did not come to abolish the law. Grace is for sinners who have given their life to Jesus Christ. the law is for those sinners who do not have the Holy Spirit. A world without laws from God will be a world overcome by evil. Jesus is the same yesterday, today , and tomorrow. You did not answer any of my points but just restated your own again. Lou Click here to reply to this post
Wow I think you only see what you want to see
Posted On: 02/12/08 04:45:27 PM
Age 30, MN
Lou I stated my point again because you keep misinterpreting what I'm saying. Again LAWS ARE GOOD, WE NEED THEM. My point is to imitate Jesus by not using the power of ceaser to enforce power over people by legislating morality because Jesus never did this. He brought his message about morality in a radiclly different way he is son of God and we are called to imitate him, he didn't need ceaser. When it comes to the pharisees again you didn't see my point, they did not want the blood on their hands and they didn't have two witnesses so they used the political system of their day to condemn Jesus, you can't argue that. Again I'll ask you, find me a passage in the gospels where Jesus uses the political system of his day to enforce morality??? Agiain laws are good. Click here to reply to this post
JESUS DESROYED SODOM FOR IMMORALITY
Posted On: 02/14/08 12:18:43 AM
Age 64, OH
You are not making sense my friend. You say laws are good but our government should not make laws. What do you propose? That people be allowed to murder and rape with no penalty. look at Cain who murdered his brother. there were consequences for what he did so the murder would not spread to all. And that was before there was a law of do not murder. But Cain knew it was wrong for Eve had already ate of the apple and had knowledge of good and evil. But Jesus came to Cain and banished him away from the rest of mankind. That was a ceaser was it not.- When the people of Sodom tried to rape angels Jesus had a ceaser for all of the dead sea plain and it was death. Jesus did legislate morality with the people of the area. Melchizedek was King of Salem and the Ling of Righteousness and he did legislate against homosexuality and rape on that day did He not. I bet it was some time before any of the people of that area sinned in that way for some time. God made david King of all Israel and David had the Holy Spirit for why else would David say to God;"please do not take your Holy Spirit from me". David was a King who had the Holy Spirit and David had laws against being immoral did he not. Lou Click here to reply to this post
When did I talk about the old testament
Posted On: 02/15/08 09:31:18 AM
Age 30, MN
When in the gospels did Jesus use Pilate to legislate law. You are twisting my words. God Bless. Click here to reply to this post
JESUS ESTABLISHED THE POLICE
Posted On: 02/15/08 06:13:46 PM
Age 64, OH
I fail to see what Pilate has to do with this. But Jesus did make laws; did he not. Jesus met Moses on the mountain and gave Moses the 10 laws that we all know. Jesus also told us in the New testament through Paul in Romans 13:1 Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you. 4For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer.-- It is very clear here that Jesus established the authorities that were to punish the law breakers so that they would CEASE their lawbreaking. Lou Click here to reply to this post
read my other posts
Posted On: 02/16/08 09:43:54 AM
Age 30, MN
I've already posted everything you are talking about. I don't feel like typing it all over again. If you would like to read a good book on what we are talking about try, "A Myth of a Christain Nation how the quest for political power is destroying the church". God Bless Click here to reply to this post
WHAT DOES GOD REQUIRE OD A MAN EXCEPT TO HAVE MERCY AND LOVE JUSTICE.
Posted On: 02/20/08 07:02:11 PM
Age 64, OH
Matthew 23:23 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cummin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former.- Some think standing for truth is a bother. If you are saying that the church is not focused on the Lord Jesus Christ then that is saying something quite different and i would agree. But you said "Changing laws and making sin illegal is not imitating Jesus because he never did this!!!! We are to pray for the government and try to influence this world for good. If the Christians do not do this then who will. The will of God is for us to live under Godly laws. This nation had Godly laws and was set up to obey the Holy Bible. That is why God blessed this Nation. The reason the Roman Republic prospered is that it was set up under Godly laws. The father was the head of the family. The whole system was family orientated. A person was innocent until prove guilty by a jury of his peers. The army was the duty of every man to serve. Every man had a voice in the government. When Rome strayed from these principles it fell. It became an empire and had a dictator. Homosexuality was accepted and many families had homosexuals teach their children. The city of Rome became a welfare city. They hired foreigners to fight in their army. When Rome strayed away from Godly laws it fell. The people became apathetic and said it did not matter what the laws were; the same as you are saying now about this nation. All evil needs to succeed is for good men to do nothing. This nation is doing the same as Rome did and the result will be the same but this nation's fall will be much more swift. What does God require of a man except to have mercy and love justice. Anyone who loves justice will make an effort to see justice served and not evil. Lou Click here to reply to this post
???
Posted On: 02/22/08 10:12:05 AM
Age 30, MN
When was Rome a godly nation???? Was this when constatine accepted christainity and made it legal and the official religion of the roman empire, and then ensued hundreds of years of barbaric bloodshed in the name of christainity??? Basiclly the romans slaughtered anyone who wouldn't accept christainity, including women and children. I would argue that the Roman empire fell because they doing the exact opposite of what Jesus taught. Lou you were making your point well until yoiu metioned the Roman Empire. Click here to reply to this post
THE BIBLE IS ALSO A HISTORY BOOK
Posted On: 02/22/08 11:22:49 PM
Age 64, OH
I stated that the Roman Empire fell because it strayed from the Godly principles of the Roman Republic. I stated what the Godly principles were and they are a matter of fact. They are many of the same principles that the USA was built on and are some of the reasons God blessed this land. Where do you think the USA got the trial by a jury of our peers and we are innocent till proven guilty from. The Jews said they followed God but they were corrupt and full of injustice. They did not follow the laws that were to protect the innocent and bring justice to the poor so God put Rome in charge over the Jews. But Rome became an empire and became corrupt also so God did away with them also. Laws that protect the innocent and poor and are just brings the blessing of The Lord Jesus. When a nation allows corrupt laws then He does away with that nation. Any people who refuse to learn history and learn form the mistakes of others are doomed to making the same mistakes that were made by others in the past. Lou Click here to reply to this post
Mom on a Mission
Posted On: 02/09/08 08:40:11 AM
Age 37, OH
Wow!! That was convicting!! All I can say is, "AMEN!" I'm a Mom with four kids also. Thanks for the reminder to keep things in perspective. Click here to reply to this post
Theologically Wrong
Posted On: 02/14/08 04:15:39 PM
Age 40, PA
Just to make sure that all involved with this string understand one thing; Israel had the revealed law to live by because they had made a covenant with God as the nation of people. They had sworn to live by it as a nation, not as a minority within a nation of unbelievers. That is why attempting to impose the OT law (and NT differences that negate much of the OT law) is not morally correct. It is for US, as believers to live by His Spirit and to show what it means to be His followers and to be imitators of Him (Eph 5), not for us to attempt to impose on others, esp. since we are the minority.
Of course if we concentrated on people's true need of acknowledging Christ as King and willfully becoming His followers, much of the law would be not required to beimposed nyway. Maybe we should concentrate on the true need and see what laws follow?
Grace and Peace,
Jim Click here to reply to this post
NUMBERS DO NOT MAKE RIGHT AND WRONG
Posted On: 02/15/08 06:22:20 PM
Age 64, OH
I do not agree with your sense of justice. Our fore fathers came to this land hundreds of years ago and paid with BLOOD, SWEAT, AND TEARS for this nation to be a Christian nation with Christian laws. There was no Muslim or Mormon blood shed. Then they let guest come in with the agreement to live by these Christian laws. Now these quest want to say we outnumber the members of your household so we will live by our rules and not yours. If you have a party at your house and the quest outnumber you does that mean they can rape your children. One man who stands with God is never a minority but is a majority. Lou Click here to reply to this post
I am grateful that you can see beyond the political and into the spiritual, and I agree 100% that evangelism and discipleship must be our primary focus. As Paul wrote in II Cor., we have been given the ministry of reconciliation--that is our primary purpose. Thank you for drawing our attention to what really matters. Click here to reply to this post
Maybe....
Posted On: 02/08/08 03:50:37 PM
Age 46, ME
Brannon,
I believe this is the single best article you've written so far. It is absolutely the best article I've read from you. The fact is, most of us are way too involved in politics than winning souls. It's not just politics though.
I've asked the Lord to move me away from this and He has in the past year. I'm not completely healed of it. But, by and large, I am not nearly as interested in politics, nor much else as I was previously. The Lord has moved my heart much in the direction of talking and desiring to help in other ways.
Christian's (yes, me too) for the most part have succumbed to the same mammom mentality of the rest of America. Just about every poll shows it, so we might as well stop lying about it.
Million dollar churches or additions to make even bigger and badder churches with bigger and badder sound systems. Why? This takes important monies away that should be used for helping the down and outters. Helping give a lift up to hurting families in our own churches and communities.
Funding more missionaries inside and outside the US. Sending people to Arkansas, Kansas, TN and others hit by
Funding VOM and other missionary organizations that smuggle bibles into despot nations.
Good Lord, what are we thinking? How much time do we have?
God COMMANDS that we be holy as He is Holy. What is holy? How do we 'do' holy in this world. Do churches even teach this anymore? Probably not that many.
I need to wake up now! Click here to reply to this post
My vote is not selfish
Posted On: 02/08/08 03:05:45 PM
Age 32, CA
I have to disagree with you. I voted for Mike Huckabee because he is pro-life. I have no clue about whatever else he stands for. My primary concern is the protection of human life. Pre-born til natural death, hopefully 100 years later. Although I do agree that it is harder to share the gospel. I still have a hard time talking about pro-life/political issues as well as the gospel with my unsaved family. So, for me they are equally just as hard to talk about/ debate. Click here to reply to this post
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